When and why would you choose B&W over colour?

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When and why would you choose B&W over colour?


MoP Creative Team
Posts: 7
Topic starter
(@mop-creative-team)
Joined: 3 years ago

Nowadays, with modern camera technology, you can shoot in colour and make the decision in post production, but the choice between B&W or colour remains a crucial one in photography. How you choose to display the final image will influence the style, mood and the story you are telling through the image...among other things.

David Yarrow shoots almost exclusively in B&W, believing that it's more "reductive" and that "B&W photography works better as art". Our other Masters of Photography, Joel Meyerowitz and Albert Watson, use it more sparingly but still to great effect. Steve McCurry shoots exclusively in colour.

Albert Watson calls it "the gigantic question". But what are your views on this great debate? And how do you choose whether an image should be displayed in colour or B&W?

 

(Note: Please do post links that promote commercial products or websites.)

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nx2t
 nx2t
(@nx2t)
Joined: 2 months ago

Posts: 1
Posted by: @mop-creative-team

Nowadays, with modern camera technology, you can shoot in colour and make the decision in post production, but the choice between B&W or colour remains a crucial one in photography. How you choose to display the final image will influence the style, mood and the story you are telling through the image...among other things.

David Yarrow shoots almost exclusively in B&W, believing that it's more "reductive" and that "B&W photography works better as art". Our other Masters of Photography, Joel Meyerowitz and Albert Watson, use it more sparingly but still to great effect. Steve McCurry shoots exclusively in colour.

Albert Watson calls it "the gigantic question". But what are your views on this great debate? And how do you choose whether an image should be displayed in colour or B&W?

 

 

      The difference between black and white and color photography is very basic in brain structure, sensation and development.  The retina “sees” black and white all over the retina and color is “seen” only in one small part, called the fovea.  Black and white information is fed to an area of the brain separate from color sensation, and much more basic and primitive.  Many animals never developed color recognition, and color recognition in humans developed much later than black and white, in a separate area. The black and white ability to see three dimensionally and to see movement is basic throughout the animal kingdom. 

   

      Black and white information tells us about all movement and three dimensionality.  There is an excellent discussion of this in Margaret Livingstone’s “Art and Vision, the Biology of Vision”.  She is a professor of neurobiology at Harvard. She also discusses how artists use luminosity, another word for black and white sensation, in color works of art, for emphasis, sensation of movement, and structure. 

 

      Not only is black and white the only way we can sense three dimensionality and movement, but it is basic to counting.  Please see “The Number Sense, How the Mind Creates Mathematics,” by Stanislas Dehaene. He is Research Director at the Institute de la Sante et de la Recherche Medicare, in Paris.  He notes that “numerosity distinction depends on circuits of our visual system that are dedicated to localizing and tracking objects in space!” I.e. black and white or luminosity sensation.  

     

     Thus, black and white function serves as the structure in our brain for all three dimension awareness of structure, movement, and counting. This information is sensed in a wider part of our retina than color and focused in an earlier and more developed area of the brain, separate from color vision. 

  

      I therefore believe that luminosity and black and white information give a higher order of awareness of our world, and that black and white photographs make a more lasting and deeper impression on our brain. 

CHARLES L STARKE MD FACP

 

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gianni.anchois
Posts: 3
(@gianni-anchois)
Joined: 5 months ago

For me it is a very personal thing. I very often find that through a B&W picture I can convey my emotions, which I felt at the time of shooting, in a much more direct, natural and sincere way. I also believe that B&W is less distracting on the viewer, and that having to work with a very reduced palette of colours you can instead concentrate on the light, the shadows and the contrast of the subject in the frame. I dare say, there might be a link with having grown up with B&W television, where the magic of the moving pictures in the TV set had to be enhanced, through your imagination, with the colours you knew they represented. Like many things in life though, I guess there is no wrong or right. Some pictures just don't work in B&W, while others take on a completely different meaning (btw - I find that cropping is also a powerful tool to turn your pictures into something you did not envision at shooting time). Finally, I must admit that, as a keen amateur photographer, I certainly lack enough technical knowledge into the subject - so this is very much straight from the heart!  Thanks for a great website. G.

P.S. Shameless plug - I just self published a short book of some of my best B&W Monochromos - the essence of light. As they say, pictures should be circulating out there and not only live on your hard drive 🙂

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1 Reply
Chris Ryan - Founder MoP
(@chrisryan)
Joined: 3 years ago

Posts: 25

@gianni-anchois Thanks for taking part Gianni. The exploration of what either colour and black & white brings to an image ...and to the artist photographer.. is a deeply personal thing...I find my output style changes ..one year like this ..another like that...depending on how I'm feeling...or what the project is. Right now I'm in a colour phase for sure. Why?...maybe it seems to fit and represent the reality we all live in right now.

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Fatih Ayoglu
Posts: 1
(@fatihayoglu)
Joined: 3 years ago

I shoot predominantly film these days. If the light is bad, overcast day, not enough light, then I choose BW because I can push to 1600 to 3200ISO. If the light is good, I want to emphasise the color then I choose between negative and positive films, depends on the scene and subject. Sometimes o shoot the same subject with both films. As Ralph Gibson said once, you took color away, you get drama

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adavidmooney@sky.com
Posts: 2
(@adavidmooneysky-com)
Joined: 2 years ago

I think the first question is are you shooting reality or are you making an image that steps away from reality.  The use of B&W  is always one step away from reality. Whether you mix colour and B&w is always controversial in a project. B&W always simplifys the image. 

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2 Replies
Chris Ryan - Founder MoP
(@chrisryan)
Joined: 3 years ago

Posts: 25

@adavidmooneysky-com Thanks for joining in...David Bailey says in his new book "Black and White is the colour of photography" But is he right?

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Paolo Damiani
(@damiani-paolo)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 6

@adavidmooneysky-com

I've always felt that B&W seems more "real" to me. Maybe I've been favoring B&W so long that my mind's eye perceives color as patently "false" (with rare exceptions).

However, the extra control afforded by digital photography is slowly pushing me toward color, but for architecture, portraiture and street photography B&W feels more genuine. For nature (birds, insects, other wildlife, most landscape) the color seems more essential in covering what I felt at the time (although landscape is a 50-50 proposition.)

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scottpease
Posts: 8
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

  I have never really thought about a photograph being better in color or as a B/W. When I'm trying to create a photograph that has lasting beauty, the first thing I look for is a subject matter that has a powerful presents and really screams to be photographed. Often I find these things purely by accident. Then, I start looking for the unique qualities of the subject and what drew me to it.  After that, I simply explore the subject from many angles until I have satisfied myself.  It's like eating your favorite food.  You eat until you are filled. Finally, choosing B/W over color is a process for me. I'll try various things to see what works best for the image, it may or may not alway be one over the other. What I will say is, B/W for me is truly my favorite because I love drama!  I appreciate the richness and the contrast of B/W in a very personal way. 

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1 Reply
Chris Ryan - Founder MoP
(@chrisryan)
Joined: 3 years ago

Posts: 25

@scottpease a very powerful image Scott...dynamic and dramatic ...black & white used at its architectural best. Thanks for sharing

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fausto.barros
Posts: 3
(@fausto-barros)
Joined: 1 year ago

Excellent topic for this forum. I always prefer B&W for most of the reasons already mentioned here: drama, you have to think about the image you are composing more carefully, it feels more artistic, and so on. And yes, for those of us shooting digital (me included) you should always be able to decide colour or B&W post-production. However, the big question for me is that deciding post-production seldom delivers the best results. I think you have to think differently from the beginning if you want to have a monochrome image that you would be proud of, and this, for me, is the biggest challenge.

What do you think about that ? I would love to hear other perspectives on this issue. 

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2 Replies
David
(@dsenoff)
Joined: 11 months ago

Posts: 5

@fausto-barros I think if you try shooting B&W film, your perception of this challenge will change instantly. Two things will happen, first, you will be forced to think in B&W while looking through the lens. Second, there will be no turning back in post. Also, and perhaps even more challenging, you will not be able to see your results instantly.  That will make your work more varied and circumspect at the same time. 

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Chris Ryan - Founder MoP
(@chrisryan)
Joined: 3 years ago

Posts: 25

@dsenoff thanks for joining in...yes ...shooting black and white film...the attention and fun to pre-visualisation when shooting is wonderful..and such an art to jump into and enjoy...you learn more every time. You start to see differently.

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Dorie Dahlberg
Posts: 11
(@dorie-dahlberg)
Joined: 9 months ago

I shoot B&W film most of the time, even though I'm trying to go digital a bit more. I come from the time when we didn't have the choice so I'm comfortable with film cameras - therefore it's B&W often by default. B&W, as someone mentioned, reduces the composition to a subject, an action, etc. however sometimes the subject is color. I've attached a film photograph I took in 2017 that had to be in color. 

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stephanie sheppard
Posts: 27
(@ssdesigns53)
Joined: 6 months ago

I love B&W because of the drama element and the fine art quality. It was very hard for me to look through the camera as a very young girl and see B&W. I was not able to translate the color into shades of grey....I drove my photographer father crazy trying to understand how to train my eyes!! But somehow, about 20 years ago it all clicked; I suddenly was able to see the effects of black and white when I got better at understanding light, and the effects on photography subjects. The digital world helped me discover these things too. We now can see instantly the difference color and B&W have on a photograph. I still love taking color shots and I tend to gravitate towards rich color, texture and nature in full color bloom.

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5 Replies
Chris Ryan - Founder MoP
(@chrisryan)
Joined: 3 years ago

Posts: 25

@ssdesigns53 thanks for joining in..a lovely black and white portrait thanks for sharing.

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stephanie sheppard
(@ssdesigns53)
Joined: 6 months ago

Posts: 27

@chrisryan

Thank you so much Chris...Lovely to hear from you. I am inserting a color photo to show the dynamic choice of when color seems and can only be the right choice. It is an abstract architecture shot from Los Angeles, called Abstract Intersections.

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stephanie sheppard
(@ssdesigns53)
Joined: 6 months ago

Posts: 27

Hi Ryan,

 

I have edited my sign in name so people can see me w/o my email and work i.d.!! So Stephanie Sheppard it is now.....

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scottpease
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

Posts: 8

@ssdesigns53 

Stephanie, Love your photo, did you make a big print of it? I know I would have. God job!

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stephanie sheppard
(@ssdesigns53)
Joined: 6 months ago

Posts: 27

@scottpease

Hi Scott, Thank you so much for your kind words. Yes, as a matter of fact this was one of ten photos chosen for a public installation at LAX Airport about eleven years ago. The theme of my exhibit was 'Abstract Architecture in Los Angeles. The print is 4ft x3.5ft. It looks amazing!!! I am posting another from the show titled 'Modern Reflection.' It was taken in Venice where there are some very interesting modern architecture examples from the 50's. It also is huge like the other one!! Cheers, Stephanie

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tcrossland
Posts: 2
(@tcrossland)
Joined: 4 months ago

I echo all the comments made so far. For me it is all down to subject and the look I’m after. Colour can be very distracting in some circumstances, but an essential component in others.  

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Dorie Dahlberg
Posts: 11
(@dorie-dahlberg)
Joined: 9 months ago

I come from a BFA program in the 1980s and didn't take photography academically. My major was drawing and printmaking (intaglio primarily). I shot film and worked in a homemade darkroom on my own. One thing that improves the translation of color to B&W in your brain is drawing. Drawing still life, people, landscapes, whatever. You spend more time with your subject; become more aware of the effects of light and the absence of light as well as value scale variations. It's just a good exercise, if nothing else, but something else happens that isn't so apparent at first.

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3 Replies
Chris Ryan - Founder MoP
(@chrisryan)
Joined: 3 years ago

Posts: 25

@dorie-dahlberg Very good points...thanks for your thoughts...does black and white help convey your image story..light...composition by removing an aspect...colour..thereby the viewer discovers more of the central image idea .by seeing in monochrome tones ? 

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Dorie Dahlberg
(@dorie-dahlberg)
Joined: 9 months ago

Posts: 11

@chrisryan Sorry I didn't reply to this sooner - I thought it was a rhetorical question. 😀 When I look through my instagram feed, I see so many people posting pictures of geometric shafts of light with a person stepping into it. Most seem to be in color and others have been converted. I suppose it was original at some point but now that idea has become a pandemic of its own. I also see people post both versions of their photos - is this because they can't decide to convert or not convert? The greatest challenge for people who photograph is finding a voice. I don't know if that voice transcends the use of color or monochromatic values. In the end, there are people who make original, thought provoking, well composed photographs in color which just look original and have a personal (signature) quality. I might even go as far as saying this might be harder to achieve in color these days. Phones take darn good photos. Removing color often removes a distraction but it also reduces the content to its essence. When you shoot B&W film, you relieve yourself of the decision. Maybe that's a good exercise for photographers of the digital age - shoot a couple rolls of B&W film to see if that changes the way you see the world.

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fausto.barros
(@fausto-barros)
Joined: 1 year ago

Posts: 3

@dorie-dahlberg Thanks for this excellent suggestion. I will try and incorporate drawing into my photographic routine as an exercise for the eye.

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scottpease
Posts: 8
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

This is a really good forum.  I like all the comments and feel that everyone has a very good understanding of B/W. As an architectural photographer I'm faced constantly with shooting color for my clients. Occasionally, I will mention how impressive an image might look as a B/W photo.  No client has ever changed their mind as of this post and I don't really expect any one of them to do so.  However, I often ask a client why don't you consider some of the work I shoot for them to be show in B/W? "Well, it's a marketing thing they say".  Their competitors don't show B/W so why should they?  I generally respond in this manner. You could be a trend setter and really define your company in a new and refreshing way.  I share one example of such a photo.  The photo was shot on 4x5 color film.  As a color image it is just OK. Unfortunately, it was shot on an overcast day which did nothing for the structure but, it accomplished what the architect wanted and he was very happy with the color version. I converted this photo to B/W a few years later and presented him with a nice 11x14 print.  Well, he immediately acknowledged the powerful look that the B/W had over the color version.  I never saw the color photo used again after that. BTW, I did take a little creative licenses with the sky in the B/W version which I have no problem doing in a commercial situation especially if the original was shot on film. I have since learned how to accomplish the look in camera so no more pretending.  

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2 Replies
Chris Ryan - Founder MoP
(@chrisryan)
Joined: 3 years ago

Posts: 25

@scottpease Thanks Scott..you two image examples are excellent. Slam dunk for me the b&w version sings out. Most of my commercial clients would have the image type and tone decided ..and sold into.. by the agency art director...and it would be an almost impossible task to change everyones direction on the shoot...too far down the sold in creative road I guess! In the film days I would often shoot a few rolls or sheets in colour anyway if it was a b&w shoot...or b&w in a colour shoot. A good many times the agency called up a  few days later ...realising they had booked b&W newsprint ad space and said " Chris I know we didnt ask for this ...but don't suppose you covered this in b&W did  you?" I was a hero for having the film up my sleeve!

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stephanie sheppard
(@ssdesigns53)
Joined: 6 months ago

Posts: 27

@scottpease

Hi Scott,

I really love these two shots of yours. They are exquisite. In fact, for me, the color shot does work really well, but alas, the B&W is so dramatic and is a clear winner in my eyes. My father was an architect, as well as a photographer, so I admire architectural photographers tremendously. I do focus on architecture in my work, but have a long way to go. I met and had long conversations with Julius Schulman in Los Angeles, sitting in his glorious studio surrounded by trees in the hills. He was so gracious and offered wonderful suggestions and insights to his work. Best, Stephanie

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Dorie Dahlberg
Posts: 11
(@dorie-dahlberg)
Joined: 9 months ago

I know this is going to sound elementary to most of the people I'm reading here but maybe there are some lurkers. I was an art educator for 25 years; I taught all grades from k-12. When I was in a middle school I started teaching value on a simple level but by the time I taught in high school, I had my students paint value scales - seven equal steps from white to black. Try it; it's not easy. It helped them understand how to control value with watercolor paint but their pencil drawings improved, too. I also had them take pictures with their phones of fields of medium value colors and convert to B&W so they could see that color and value are two different things. They saw there was barely any difference between the grays. Someone mentioned that they see in B&W but I'd say, you're seeing value and being able to anticipate that a conversion may or may not succeed. 

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3 Replies
stephanie sheppard
(@ssdesigns53)
Joined: 6 months ago

Posts: 27

@dorie-dahlberg

Hi Dorie,

Thanks for your interesting posts. But, I am confused as to your reference; "lurkers." I don't really understand what you mean by that term. Could you clarify for me. Thanks, Stephanie

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Dorie Dahlberg
(@dorie-dahlberg)
Joined: 9 months ago

Posts: 11

@ssdesigns53 Some people read forums but never contribute for whatever reason. They might be there to learn, though.

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stephanie sheppard
(@ssdesigns53)
Joined: 6 months ago

Posts: 27

@dorie-dahlberg

Hi Dorie, I understand now, thank you. Yes that is true. I find forums a great way to bounce ideas and learn from other like-minded -artists. Thanks so much for your insights, really great. Stephanie

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scottpease
Posts: 8
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

   I am very happy to share my images in this forum because your appreciation for B/W is so strong. If any of you have every shot film did you also attempt to learn the Zone System? This is of course the system that Ansel Adam's perfected for capturing a full tonal gray scale on film, then processing that film to match up to a specific paper that was capable of reproducing the entire scale. I never truly mastered this process but I understand the system and what a photograph should look like. I have been able to work with digital images in Photoshop and reproduce the entire scale in the manner that the Zone System was meant to work or at least I think I can. It is truly amazing to see just how wonderful a full scale B/W photograph can look when handled properly.  The key however is and always will be the lighting. B/W requires a little more sensitivity to this than color.  Color is color and the contrast of the colors seem to make or break most photo. In either case lighting and composition will always be king. 

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spako
Posts: 5
(@spako)
Joined: 1 year ago

I started out doing color photography only, using a huge amount of postprocessing in photoshop and doing (very bad) HDRs. I mainly oversaturated everything trying to emulate “that look” people tend to appreciate when clicking through endless feeds... and suddenly I grea wary of this..

For the last ten years I have moved on and exclusively shoot bnw, to that point that I “see” in bnw and know what will work and what will not work. To me it is more seeing light, shadow, contrasts, and of course the subject... 

whenever I try to go back to colour I feel like something is missing.

i do appreciate color photography, i like the use of color as a subject and I am well aware that some shots just don’t work in bnw, but nevertheless I stick to bnw.

 

I think to me it is very personal, I strongly identify with bnw 🙂

 

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4 Replies
David
(@dsenoff)
Joined: 11 months ago

Posts: 5

@spako this is a beautiful image!

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spako
(@spako)
Joined: 1 year ago

Posts: 5

@dsenoff thank you ☺️ I really appreciate ☺️

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stephanie sheppard
(@ssdesigns53)
Joined: 6 months ago

Posts: 27

@spako

Hi Spako, Really like this abstract b&w....very interesting. Stephanie

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spako
(@spako)
Joined: 1 year ago

Posts: 5

@ssdesigns53thank you stephanie 🙂

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scottpease
Posts: 8
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

Here's a question for anyone.  I'm not happy with the way my photos appear on this site. When I click on the link to view, way to contrasty and simply does not show the image very well. When I look at the same link on my iPhone in Safari they look a whole lot better!  Thoughts???

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2 Replies
Chris Ryan - Founder MoP
(@chrisryan)
Joined: 3 years ago

Posts: 25

@scottpease

Hi Scott...your images look great to me on my monitor here! ...But just to understand the potential issue...when you enter our forum.... your images look better on Iphone than on a laptop?  When using the same web browser? An Iphones screen is often better than alot of monitors for tonality. The whole internet compresses all colours and tones and surprisingly, many of the most popular browsers such as Internet Explorer, Google Chrome and Opera simply ignore all colour profiles embedded into pictures. Therefore, for a better photo-viewing experience, you could try to use a color-managed browser. The best and the most popular colour-managed browser is Mozilla Firefox. However please do email us at info@mastersof.photography with exact details and we'll get someone way more techy than me to take a look for sure. Nice work again though...best Chris

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scottpease
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

Posts: 8

@chrisryan I'm am using Safari on both my computer and my iPhone.

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roblavers
Posts: 3
(@roblavers)
Joined: 1 year ago

For a long time I rejected the concept of b/w using a modern camera when excellent colour film and now digital are available, and I still only find it acceptable in very limited applications. The reasons? First, all the iconic b/w photos we are familiar with up to the mid 20c were made because that was the only option available so to me have an authenticity, but where there is a choice it seems perverse and pretentious to try and emulate the earlier style, and especially so converting a digital file. Second, a b/w image of a flower or landscape for instance is drained of life, we are fortunate to be able to see in colour so we should celebrate that; in painting artists very rarely use black paint on its own, preferring to mix a dark shade and the classical renaissance painters would build up dark shadow areas in multiple layers to gain depth. However I now recognise that sometimes a b/w can work best, especially when colour is almost non-existent or distracts but my question is always, why is that not in colour? (And before you ask, yes there were technical reasons for my mugshot to be b/w!)

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scottpease
Posts: 8
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

I'd love your thoughts and opinions on this shot. This was a tough shot to get because we were fishing at the time and the boat capital was favoring one of the guys fishing on our boat so I was at a slight disadvantage.

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Carsten Lueter
Posts: 4
(@carsten-lueter)
Joined: 6 months ago

Shooting predominantly 135mm and MF film, the choice between color and b/w always causes a problem: You need two cameras (or camera backs) to be prepared! For me the choice is dictated by the message I want to convey. If I am shooting a project, I decide beforehand and stick to it for the sake of consistency. The level of abstraction an image has in b/w helps to emphasize certain characters of the subject. This is especially true for portraits and nature photography. I am a biologist and the color vs. b/w debate in photography in a way reminds me of the discussion about whether to use photographic images or drawings in a scientific paper. Here, drawings are much better to highlight certain characters of a given subject, whereas photographs give you the "real" impression of it.  E.g. abstract photographs which by definition are not intended to show reality often work better in b/w (except color is the main subject, of course). I always let the subject matter "decide" whether color or monochrome is best and while composing the shot I rarely have the situation that I cannot decide between the two options.

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1 Reply
scottpease
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

Posts: 8

@carsten-lueter Well, that's one way to look at it. You should show a few examples of your work.

 

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jerome.camus
Posts: 1
(@jerome-camus)
Joined: 2 months ago

I think b&w is about light and shapes, color is about same but with a third feature. So color photography is in my opinion more complex as you have to play with 3 elements versus 2 in b&w. So I feel it is easier to make nice image in b&w than it is in color, and that does not mean that b&w images are easy to do or not interesting, please don’t get me wrong. Sometimes when I am unhappy with my shots I turn them into b&w and find it easier to « save » them, especially when shooting in difficult light conditions. This said there are lots of b&w images that I find fantastic and would not work as well in color.

Also, « color » covers a lot of different realities (so does b&w), there are lots of film simulations and ways to work your color in post, which opens the door to a lot of creativity. 

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1 Reply
scottpease
(@scottpease)
Joined: 5 months ago

Posts: 8

@jerome-camus. Well, I would not disagree with you at all. My comments about black and white photography and how I come to either take them or convert them is based strictly on the image itself.  I have found that in some cases images I have taken in color just don't sparkle or have a life of their own in color.  That may be due to the weather or lack of direct sun to create interesting shadows which then create the depth. But what the photograph must have above all else is a very strong visual or graphic appeal/intent.  It's all about the lines in the image whether they are man made or natural and the lighting that is present when I took the photo.  I really don't even see the image as a B/W initially, sometimes that comes after I sit down and look at the image and try a few things to see where it takes me.  Often times I find that the image really speaks to me in B/W v.s. color for no other reason that its simplicity, texture, and contrast.  Sometimes these things just come together in a magical way.  I am always happy to find these images in particular because often times I am flustered by the way the photo looked in color.  I'd rather find a photo that can be converted to B/W and become a real art piece v.s. a so so color shot that will just sit in the archive vault for ever.

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